Accessory Damage or Defence

Discussion in 'PC' started by Novamaster, Dec 14, 2011.

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  1. Patchumz

    Patchumz Dark Caster

    I had +4 defense on all my stuff since the update came out, then switched to +4% damage now that I've gotten some skill at avoiding damage.
  2. Silty

    Silty Green Slime

    No, I mean that 2% crit is not effective, because it's only about as effective as 2% damage, not 4% damage. The best crit modifier is approximately half as effective as the best damage modifier.

    Attack speed is arguable, but the wiki says that it caps at -30% so you'll hit the cap before you get -20% in items, if you have the melee armor. Maybe 1 or 2 items would be fine for someone who's really into melee, but as far as I know, you can't melee any of the bosses besides the Destroyer. The damage is probably worse than pure +damage, but it's more defensive than pure +damage (in other words, a balanced option) since it helps you knockback/stunlock monsters.

    And I'm pretty sure movement speed does hardly anything if you have Spectre Boots. If you are into mobility, you probably have them, so you have to *really* be into mobility to sacrifice defense/damage for that extra tiny boost.

    So I guess OP was at least right that damage and defense are your 2 main options.
  3. Pentarctagon

    Pentarctagon Green Slime

    As for the movespeed, does it stack with hermes/spectre boots or not, because the anklet of the wind doesn't.
  4. Silty

    Silty Green Slime

    I hear that it makes you accelerate faster, but only very slightly so. It doesn't actually change your top speed.
  5. Deoxysprime

    Deoxysprime Squirrel

    Defense is inherently stronger than percent based damage solely based on defense's FLAT power. Defense just burns off damage like it's nothing. 20% damage requires that you be using a weapon with already high damage per second. Percent based damage relies on already doing a lot of damage. Flat defense works for everything.

    Now I'm not saying give up on damage because it's useless, because that's frankly not the case. If you are amazing at dodging attacks, have tons of supplies, and have general mastery of the game, defense becomes less valuable (unless you are melee.)

    Melee: Pick damage if you have a strong auto-swing weapon with good enough knockback to hold off waves of enemies. Pick defense in almost every other situation.

    Magic: I don't use magic much, but I would assume it's in the same boat as ranged.

    Ranged: Damage is much stronger if you use ranged because distance correlates to defense. (Defense being the ability to keep health high. Distance prevents damage.) If you use a somewhat close range weapon or you're bad at dodging, grab defense.

    ... Also note that percent based damage is a PERCENT, not a flat amount. If you hit for 10 damage per attack, but hit 10 times per second, you deal 120 damage in a second. (If the percent increase is 20% flat.) If you hit for 100 damage per attack but only hit once a second, you deal 120 damage.

    Defense is flat in the manner that it runs off of this equation: Damage Reduction = ROUND_UP(Defense/2)
    What does this mean? It means that defense runs in a very flat manner. If you have 30 defense, you reduce damage by roughly 15. If you have 35, it's 18. If you have 80, it's 40. It's flat reduction, if you take a hit for 40 with 80 defense, you take 1 damage. If you take a hit for 40 with 30 defense you take 25 damage.

    Tl;dr: Pick damage if you already do a lot of damage and you dodge well. Pick defense if you find yourself taking a lot of damage or you don't deal a lot of damage already. Defense is strong no matter what, percent damage is only strong if you do a lot of damage.
  6. Attackspeed will always do worse than dmg because defense reduction is flat, not a percent. If you hit for 10 once a second or hit for 5 twice a second you'd have 10 DPS for both. Add in 1 defense and now the first has 9 DPS [(10-1)*1] and the second has 8 DPS [(5-1)*2]. Also, if you use ranged or magic, you expend more magic/ammo per the DPS with speed over damage. The only use of attackspeed is to slightly increase applied knockback effects, but there really isn't much of a need for that as things either have a ton of knockback or none at all. :/ It's why they need to fix the defense system into a precentage type.

    2% crit (times 5 for 10%) gives you that much chance to deal double damage. Using a weapon with X damage would give you (X*2)*0.1=0.2*X dmg. If you use the Mencaing, you would get X*0.2=0.2*X increase in damage.

    They add up to be the same, difference being that crit is more bursty. I prefer the more constant damage myself, but it doesn't make crit bad, it would actually probably be better for PvP.

    EDIT: As for using Menacing over warding, all I can tell you is that my Shotgun 1 shots mobs in the Corruption and Hallowed regularly when I spec all dmg. I find being able to kill things in 1 hit often to be the best form of defense.
  7. Silty

    Silty Green Slime

    I dunno, personally I like the system, since it adds flavor to fast-but-weak vs strong-but-slow weaponry. It feels less a lot less bland than your typical RPG's defense system. Buffing the attack speed modifiers to 1.5%/3%/4.5%/6% per accessory would make it viable but not overpowered, since it only applies to melee weapons, unlike the damage. Critical strike probably needs a buff too, maybe something like 1.5%/3% instead of 1%/2%. That would solve some of the accessory modifier imbalances without removing the flavor of the game.
  8. Pentarctagon

    Pentarctagon Green Slime

    given a weapon that deals 10 damage to enemy X:

    base damage = 10.
    crit chance from just accessories = 10%.
    crit damage = 20.
    average total damage after 10 shots = 110 (9*10 + 1*20). 9 normal hits + 1 crit.

    base damage = 10.
    bonus damage from just accessories = 20%.
    new damage = 12.
    total damage after 10 shots = 120 (10*12).

    So getting the damage increase on accessories does give more damage than crit chance.
  9. N1ckx2

    N1ckx2 Blazing Wheel

    Early Hard mode, warding is better, because you barely have any defense in the beginning of hard mode so 20 defense is a lot.

    But late hard mode, I think menacing is better. I still use warding but am in the process of reforging my accessories. In end-hard mode, you have high DPS weapons and you will be more skilled at dodging attacks. Since defense is flat, taking 10 less damage than normal is not a lot. When you are taking 80 DMG (without armor from a mimic), 10 less damage is not a lot considering you only have 400 HP. But against a 500 HP enemy (again, a mimic), 20% is a lot.

    In PvP, damage is obviously better because 20 defense will only lower damage by 5 (damage is doubled in PvP) while 20% damage can increase damage by a lot (22 for a godly Dao of pow). Also, against hard mode bosses, damage is also more important because you are going to be taking a lot of damage anyways and 10 less damage won’t be as good as 20% more damage.

    This is my OPINION backed up by stats. If you disagree with me, please post your argument RESPECTFULLY. Thanks
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