Upgradeable equipment

Discussion in 'Suggestions Archive' started by Eltu, May 27, 2011.

  1. Eltu Green Slime

    Right now there isn't much of a reward for killing enemies - and I think most of you agree with me that an XP system is a very bad idea.

    What I want to suggest instead, is to make different monsters have a chance to drop certain items, that can be used to improve your equipment - think runes in Diablo 2.

    So for instance, slimes would have a slight chance to drop "poisonous gel", that you could enhance any of your equipment with - either one of your weapons to cause poison damage, or a piece of armor to add poison resistance and increased armor against slimes.

    They could also have a chance to drop "luminescent gel" (enchant weapons or armor for them to light up the environment when used), "combustible gel" (weapon attacks get splash damage, armor protects slightly against knockback), etc, etc.

    Zombies could have a chance to drop "zombie heart", "rotten tooth", etc, etc - each with different effects like above.

    For obvious reasons, each weapon and armor should have ONE slot only for this kind of improvement.

    So, what do you think of this idea? It'd add variation, uniqueness to different players, and a motivation to kill enemies - and it's all based on the same "equipment, not xp" system that makes Terraria so good. ;)

    ...

    On the subject of this vs. randomized equipment stats:
    Jack33 likes this.
  2. tomany2 Green Slime

    Check out my "Randomized weapon stats" thread, alot of this is pointed out in there... some have said about socketing weapons, and enchanters... O.T. you do have some good points in there.
  3. Eltu Green Slime

    Ah, this is interesting, since - I was first intending to suggest exactly that, randomized weapon stats.

    I thought it through a bit though, and realised something - Terraria is fun because the player is in control of what kind of character he wants to have, and what he wants to do. Because Terraria's progression is based on finding and crafting better items, the player always feel like he is actually becoming stronger - not like with an RPG/XP system where he's getting stronger just because the game tells him to.

    In other words - having randomized weapon stats isn't a bad idea, but I ultimately felt it will conflict with the core gameplay of Terraria. The player would not be in control of the unique stats of the weapons, they would simply be there because the game says they are.

    With a pure enchantment system as described above, we would get the exact same results - however, this time the upgrades would be in the hands of the player, and they would be a part of the chain of events making up the entire game. The player finds an item from a monster, the player chooses how to use this item and what equipment to upgrade - it's all CRAFTING, and thus a natural part of Terarria's gameplay.

    Short version/tl;dr: The suggestion in the OP is the same thing as randomized weapon stats, just adapted to Terraria's gameplay.
  4. tomany2 Green Slime

    yeah but the only problem i see is say the zombie heart gives the maximum possible upgrade to the weapon, say... + 10 damage, and you use it on the sun fury, you now have a godly weapon, with almost nothing in comparison right? but now, you will be bored of the game again because you, yet again have nothing to strive for... you have the best, there is nothing else to find. IMO random stats means there is always a possibility of a better weapon out there, thus making you want to keep searching for it, so if you found a flail with + 10 randomized, there is always the chance you can find a +11 or more, or even a + 6 with a faster swing speed.

    But that is just my opinion :p
  5. Eltu Green Slime

    I see what you mean, however - it is only so many chests in the game, so soon you would run out of weapons to find anyway.

    And adding random stats to items you craft yourself makes no sense. The whole idea of crafting is that the player is in charge of what will be made - adding random effects would act detrimentally here, and make the player feel like he is no longer in control of the crafting process.

    As for the sun fury example - there wouldn't be a "maximum upgrade" - rather, different ways to upgrade. None of these items would upgrade something BETTER than the other, just in different ways. Naturally it's impossible to balance this perfectly, but at least so some extent. In other words, two players could craft entirely different sets of the same weapon/armor.

    To bring up an example:

    Player A has a Sunfury upgraded to poison enemies, making it way more effective against swarming enemies than a vanilla one. Player A also has a full set of cobalt armor, enchanted to protect against knockback, so that he, again, can easily take out a large number of enemies without fearing to be knocked away.

    Player B also has a Sunfury, but this one is enchanted to steal life from enemies he hits. He also has a full set of Cobalt Armor, which is upgraded to further increase health generation. Now, this player would be deal less damage than player A, but have a larger survivability rate.

    And the point is - both these players have customized these properties themselves - they have chosen what effects they want, went out and fought to get them, and made it all themselves. They have upgraded themselves as a part of the equipment system already present in Terraria.

    I'd suggest that these enchantments also change the appearance of the equipment - and thus, suddenly every player could differ drastically from the other, both in terms of playstyle and appearance.

    If it's long-term play you worry about, a compromise can easily be made - make different strength levels of these monster drops - for instance, a Minor Poisonous Gel, a Poisonous Gel, a Major Poisonous Gel, and a Legendary Poisonous gel, all with different drop rates - but all dropping from slimes. This would add the addictive and fun effect of random item stats, but still incorporate it in the gameplay in a good way, making it a part of Terraria's crafting system instead of making it seem out of place. ;)
  6. Eltu Green Slime

    Bumping this up a bit - would be really interesting to hear some more feedback on this idea. ;)
  7. BuildingManiac Green Slime

    I'm going to agree, the randomized stats, does take a way the feeling of becoming more powerful. I'm a avid RPG player and love playing them, but I mostly like the idea of having control of the story and how strong I am. I like your idea Eltu, I was thinking though, possibly, items could have "Slots", which slots could be increased to a maximum number of 2. Having 2 slots per a weapon makes it somewhat, different. For example(editing on your example):

    Player A has a Sunfury upgraded with 2 slots. He puts Poison in slot 1 and HP steal in slot 2. This way, he can steal HP and Poison his foes. This kills foes over time and gives him HP over time, allowing him to save mana.

    Player B also has a Sunfury, upgraded with 2 slots. He puts in +5% Attack Speed in slot one and HP steal in slot 2. This way, he
    deals damage fast and drains hp fast, but he runs out of mana faster.

    Yes, I know, we have mana potions, but saving mana and not using all those potions is always a good idea.

    Having slots, allows the player to vary the differences.
  8. Eltu Green Slime

    Yeah, I agree - as long as there's not too many slots (since we need to put an emphasis on customization, which is impossible with too many options at the same time) - just a few, so the player have to choose a lot. 2 slots is perfect, allows for a lot of customization but not so much that they player can simply put all upgrades in one weapon. ;)
  9. Godknown Green Slime

    I like the slots idea, because then you could make scopes (for extending sight) with a lens and some other material, and then a flash suppressor (very, very little light comes from position of shooting, and bullets fired no longer glow and have no trail.)
  10. Eltu Green Slime

    I can see the practical use of that in PvP. :D

    But yeah, I am all for the idea of having both craftable upgrades, and ones you find from monsters (like described in the OP). The main focus should still be at killing monsters to get them, though, for the reasons described a bit above. ;)
  11. BuildingManiac Green Slime

    I choose 2 slots, because I also figured, it'd be best to keep the customization wide, but make sure the player couldn't just go off, using all the upgrades. :)
  12. Godknown Green Slime

    Unless you get the "rail" attachment for a gun, which allows it two additional slots (three total unused after rail is attached.)
  13. Eltu Green Slime

    I don't think any more than 2 slots is a good idea, since the player would then be able to add way too many different upgrades - there must be a tough choice. Besides, guns aren't that frequent and all upgrades should be available for all weapons/armor (just with different effects, like described in the OP).
  14. -GN Squirrel

    I like this idea a lot, but I think there should be some kind of stand, or even an NPC who you can pay for upgrading your weapon with this and that. It might even take some time, and he'll ask you to come back the next day, or something.
    Also, some games has this kind of upgrading(Stick Ranger is an example), but you can't remove the effects put on your already upgraded weapon. Would this be something like this, you think?

    I hope this kind of system makes it into the game. It'll add a whole new level to PVP and boss fighting(hell, defeating a boss with a crappy weapon with awesome upgrades using a good strategy might be possible. :D), even though the latter is getting easy... heh.
  15. Eltu Green Slime

    -GN:

    Yes, a special "workbench" or NPC is a good idea - after all, things shouldn't be too easy. ;) As for upgrades being permanent, I think the best solution is letting the player replace upgrades, BUT at the cost of losing the previous upgrade (so you couldn't use it for any other weapon). I also think that upgrading weapons and armor should cost money - since we're not seeing much use for money later in the game anyway, so it's a good use for it. ;)

    As an example:
    A player has upgraded his sword with Minor Poisonous Gel, making it deal poison damage. Now the player finds a Fallen Soul (Eater of Souls very rare drop) allowing his sword to instead steal life. He wants this upgrade but has no slots left, so he has to pay again for the upgrade and replace the gel with the soul.

    He now has a sword upgraded with a Fallen Soul, but the poisonous gel is gone forever, lost in the replacement.
  16. BuildingManiac Green Slime

    Good idea, from both of you.
  17. Human No More Green Slime

    It's an excellent idea to be able to upgrade weapons, but upgrades should be removable as well (destroying the upgrade item) for if the player wants to change them.
    Randomisation isn't so much as it will just encourage people to farm for an optimal item while most others will simply be ignored, plus it prevents named items with specific special attributes if they are completely randomly generated.
  18. LNeone Slimed Zombie

    This is a good idea for the game, but i think that it would make item farming a bigger part of the game, also if you were to enter a PvP server with the most upgraded armor/weapons you could just be unstoppable. If it were added there would have to be a nuffier when you enter servers

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